a Survey of Numbers in Wu July 1 2009 5 comments

There are a few things I find myself asking when I meet people from previously unheard of parts of China; How do you say 你好谢谢 and 再见? Then I ask for numbers one to ten. I’m sure I’ve annoyed my share of people with these seemingly useless questions, but for me they’ve always given me a good idea of the sound of a dialect. Furher, numbers always seemed important to me as some of the most common and useful words to learn.

The following is a list of numbers from one to ten in the dialects running from Shànghǎi to Nánjīng with the last four columns covering Hángzhōu, Qúzhōu/Jiāngshān, Línhǎi and Chánglè dialects all from Zhèjiāng province. Holes in the table do not represent an absence of that number but rather an absence of data in my possession. Note I’m missing a bit of Suzhou dialect. If anyone is willing to send a clear recording of those numbers by a native speaker, I would be grateful and your name would appear in pixely lights on the site.

  江苏省 → 浙江省 →  
    上海  苏州  无锡  武进  高淳  杭州  衢州  临海  长乐 
    Shànghǎi  Sūzhōu  Wúxī  Wǔjìn  Gāochún  Hángzhōu  Qúzhōu  Línhǎi Chánglè
1 ieʔ5 ieʔ43 ieʔ5 ieʔ5 ieʔ35 i  iɘʔ  ieʔ5 ʔiʔ5
2 ɲi13 _ _ ɲi224 ɲiɯ35 əz̩24 _ ɲiɔ ɲi35
2 liã13 liɛʔ14 liaŋ213 liaŋ213 35 liaŋ53 liã  liã35 ʔliaŋ22
3 sɛi52 se̞ seɛʔ5 5 ɕiɛ5 sɛ̝435 434 31 s̃æ311
4 sz̩35 sz̩523 sz̩52 sz̩334 sz̩34 sz̩24 sz̩  sz̩4 sz̩44
5 ɦŋ̩23 ŋ̩231 ŋ̩14 ŋ̩224 ŋ̩5/ʋɯ5† u53 ŋ̩  ŋ̩53 ŋ̩22
6 lɔʔ12 lɔʔ23 lɔʔ14 lɔʔ24 35 ly  ləʔ12 loʔ23 loʔ5
7 ʨʰiɛʔ5 _ ʨʰiʔ5 ʨʰiɛʔ5 ʨʰiɛʔ3 ×ʔ5 ʨʰ×ʔ5 ʨʰieʔ5 tsʰiʔ5
8 paʔ55 boʔ baʔ5 baʔ5 baʔ3 paʔ5 paʔ5 pɜʔ5 pæʔ5
9 ʨiɤ34 _ ʨiɑo324 ʨiɤɯ51 ʨy53 ʨyo435 ʨiɯ  tsiəu53 ʨiøy53
10 zəʔ12 23 14 sɛʔ24 sa35 zz̩  ʒəʔ12 ʑieʔ23 zəʔ2

A couple notes: Due to its greater frequency over 二, 两 has been given for most dialects. While 二 is still used frequently, e.g. the “twenty two” in “two hundred and twenty two”, it will be replaced in most. So, for example, an apartment numbered 2210 will be read as “两两一零”.

In some cases I have only partial data and no speakers handy of whom I can ask the favour. The number 7 in Hangzhou, for example, I know to be a high tone and terminating with a glottal stop. However the specific text from which I’ve taken that information did not provide information on the vowel and guessing didn’t seem appropriate.

The Wǔjìn set was taken from one of many villages in the Wǔjìn area. It’s a slightly more rural sound than you may get closer to downtown Wujin or Changzhou. The most notable difference between the list for Wujin and urban Changzhou dialect is 三 becomes seiʔ5.

This took quite some time to compile using a number of sources. Most are from recordings I’ve made and transcribed myself. Some are my own transcriptions from outside recordings. Most of the Zhejiang data were compiled from a number of academic papers on Wu, mostly available through the Wu Association page. If you’re curious about specifics let me know and I’ll get the details.

Some of the tone numbers for recorded samples have been taken from various of sources including work by the ubiquitous YR Chao and Glossika’s excellent collection of tone tables. Trusting their research over my own ears I’ve done my best to match the sounds I heard to the tone values given. I reserve the right to have completely missed the mark on the tones and transcription.

This is especially true with the Gaochun tones. Due to the age of my speaker there is a notable discrepancy with what is available elsewhere, mostly because what’s elsewhere is at least a generation older. If you look hard enough you may find the table to the right, scanned from some text of dialect tone tables. I imagine it’s where the Glossika tones came from and unfortunately there’s only the one set. There are some notable and consistent differences between my speaker and the tables, so perhaps we can call the Glossika numbers 高淳老派 and these 高淳新派.

Of less academic value but greater practical value, I offer the following table. A large part of my motivation for compiling this data was to get a better sense of the ἰδέα҂. What follows is my best guess at a collection of what should be universally understood numbers. Superscript corresponds to Mandarin tones, not tone values as in the previous table.

ieʔ1 liaŋ2 1 sz̩ ŋ3 lɔʔ/loʔ2 ʨʰiɛʔ1 baʔ1 ʨiɯ2 sa1

For what it’s worth I’ve had some success with this in Changzhou and Wujin as well as with one Shanghai transplant and one from Danyang.

- – -
† I’ve given two different pronunciations for 五 in Gaochun dialect. The first (ŋ̩5) is used by the older generations while the second (ʋɯ5) is used by younger speakers. The influence of the neighbouring Mandarin is all too apparent.
‡ What’s more confusing is the number 222 (read [liã35 pɐʔ5 ɲiɪ113 n2] in Linhai dialect) which like most Wu dialects makes good use of 廿 for 20. The northern equivalent (rendered in Pinyin style spelling) would be roughly “liang be nei ni”.
҂ As in Plato.







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4 Comments
  1. Sebastian, July 1, 2009:

    What are your sources for the Shanghai dialect?

    Please correct me if I’m wrong, but I think the majority of the pronunciations you have here are incorrect — or at least they depart from the standard pronunciation.

    I have in front of me three books: 自学上海话(上海大学出版社),上海话大词典(上海辞书出版社),and 学说上海话(交通大学出版社). They are unanimous in suggesting the following corrections:

    3: ɛ for e
    5: voiced (ɦŋ), 13 tone
    6: 22 tone
    8: unvoiced (p for b)
    9: 34 tone
    10: voiced (z for s), 13 tone

    Or maybe it just depends who you are talking to…


  2. Sebastian, July 1, 2009:

    Whoops, I made a mistake myself with two of those:

    3: ɛ for ei
    10: voiced (z for s), 22 tone, WITH GLOTTAL STOP


  3. Kellen, July 1, 2009:

    It’s quite possible, as I mentioned in the post. I must take issue with one point though. There’s no standard pronunciation for Shanghainese; there’s only one that may be geographically central.

    The Shanghainese transcription was my own doing, taken from audio. Granted my sample was small, and I also thought, for example, there ought to have been a glottal stop on 10, but having not heard it I left it out. And I take full fault for my inconsistencies w/ p and b, all of which are more than likely unvoiced and un-aspirated. It was something I meant to sort out and had forgotten about until now. I’ll go through and see what I can do.

    I’m thinking though for the most part that there’s a very good chance all of those texts were relying on the same data and simply reprinting it as-is. It wouldn’t be the first time. Alternatively there could be differences based on the time the information in the books was written.

    Thanks for the info. I’ll have a look.


  4. Kellen, November 1, 2009:

    It took me months to get around to this but I’ve finally changed the table re Shanghainese. I went with your corrections for some of them but others I changed based on another Shanghainese dictionary. 22 for 6 doesn’t seem right based on how I hear it, and a couple dictionaries give 12 so I went with that.

    Thanks again for the input.


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